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Old 05-21-2010, 07:06 AM
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Default coil question

whats the effect off having a very litle bit bigger coil former , the windings are also litle bigger

results in coil beiing closer to magnet
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Old 05-21-2010, 07:18 AM
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I would think this would increase the force of the motor on the coil, based on the physics of magnetic fields and all, but I'm not sure exactly how that theory translates to sub building/design.

And where was the 170? You said it was coming at ESBN...
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Old 05-21-2010, 07:39 AM
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with more coil in the gap, your Bl will increase. which is why you see alot of companies going with an 8 layer flat wound coil. When looking for SPL, the woofer will be louder when the coil is closer to the pole. Me personally dont always reccommend this for daily applications due to coil rock, but when playing a single tone, there isnt nearly as much rocking. A few years ago, Thilo came up with a coil that was thicker at the bottom than it was at the top. This way even as the coil traveled up out of the gap, the thickest part of the coil remained in the gap, keeping a higher BL, also making the subwoofer perform in a more linear fashion.

the original 4HP and the SS XXX motors both have wide gaps (which is one reason they make great sounding woofers). One thing JD did to make them both better was to use a coil that was very tight to the pole piece that was thicker than the original coils. Then he made the coils very lightweight. While his TSNS wasnt always the best sounding woofers, they had the potential to be very loud woofers(with a shit ton of trophies to back it up).

Hope this helps Peter. Did you break that 70 mark yet??
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Old 05-21-2010, 07:40 AM
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My first response is zero to partially no effect.

Second to that, all other aspects being equal and the original assembly being correct, I would expect the negative side effects would outweigh and benefits.

The coil being horizontally closer to the magnet will make it be less centered in the gap[which could make it stronger], but it will have less cooling and be more likely to rub.


[I want to clarify that my post is in no way intended to disagree with Demonik Audio's post or 98AckCL23's post.]

Last edited by iamsonic; 05-21-2010 at 07:47 AM. Reason: clarify
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Old 05-21-2010, 07:52 AM
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Sonic, I'm going to assume that Peter's asking for a project for the competition lanes, at which point the likelyhood of getting coil rock (and subsequently rub) are diminished (like Demonic Audio said) due to only playing 1 sine wave rather than dynamic music. But yes, you're right, the chance of rock/rub does increase greatly as you move the coil closer to the motor.
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Old 05-21-2010, 08:54 AM
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the thing is the company wich makes the coils for CS made a mistake and build coils wich was a litle bit bigger than all coils was before
they where in a rush to get them done since Cs had ordered a whole lot off coils ,

on the same power i lost about 1.5db at high power level
and about 0.6 on low power level
also my coils become pretty warm after a high power burp wich was not the case before
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Old 05-21-2010, 09:18 AM
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The number of turns in the gap changed, sounds like the gauge of wire they used was different.. Do you have pics of each coil?
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Old 05-21-2010, 09:24 AM
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both coils looked the same

for windings its same also

old good coil is 3.901"
the new wrong fabricated are 3.960"
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Old 05-21-2010, 09:31 AM
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Peter something changed.. Just having the coil a touch bigger in OD is not going to change your spl like your seeing, nor the heat problem. Unless your rubbing the inside of the top plate when under power.
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Old 05-21-2010, 09:34 AM
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as I said before, cooling could be an issue but five one hundredths of an inch isn't much.[3.2/64ths of an inch][1.6/64ths of an inch increase in radius]
I would honestly believe your decline in SPL is due to the suspension possibly not being broke-in yet.
Without documented impedence rise then vs now, it's very hard to say what if any effect the larger former has caused.
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